In this session, we’ll have a discussion about one of Jung’s concepts – Anima/Animus Archetypes that influence men and women in intimate relationships.
We explain the power of these archetypes to take over your life and make romantic decisions where you feel powerless to the force of passion.
Understand how your personal history influences your Anima or Animus and how you can transform your relationships to create a more conscious bond and attraction.
- What is an archetype?
- Defining the Anima/Animus
- What happens when we fall in love
- Stages of Romantic Love
- How your shadow influences your attraction to the opposite sex
Episode 9 Transcript
Welcome to Creative Mind Living a podcast for personal growth based on the works of Carl Young, neuroscience and Eastern philosophies. We’re your hosts. Debra Barone Maldonado and Dr Rob Maldonado, founders of Creative Mind Coaching.
Saturday. We’re talking about the anima animus,
the divine other,
because we like to talk about Complicated. Yes, no, it’s It’s an incredible subject because ah Young really saw it as an important piece off the individual ation process. So we’re going to talk about how does it play into intimate relationships because it does play into intimate really, should be. We could say it’s it’s really the Oregon with which we connect with each other besides the sexual
theory organ. Well, I like calling it the divine other because it’s really when we truly fall in love. We’re seeing the divine in the other person. Nor that infatuation is We think the other person is divine and it’s a misperception, and we fall into that shiny little beautiful ah you know, image of that person and their their bright and wonderful and and then eventually they let us down there. Not they’re not. It’s almost like they, they, um, was a bait and switch,
right? Yeah, and thinking about it. We were thinking, there’s three things that we want to talk about. One is the anima animus as a force of the psyche and of nature. Ah, the other one is what is falling in love, meaning in the context of this force that drives us and compels us to to seek out strangers and become one with them in a in a sense, And then the other one is what are the spiritual dimensions of this anima animus work?
And so let’s start off those of you. I hope you participated in our three part series on the intro to young in depth coaching, and we talked about our coach training, and this is definitely something. We go deeper in our coach training, so just want to put a shot out. If you’re interested in going deeper, please let us know and we’ll let you know how you could go deeper with this work. But let’s start off with. We talked about that. The map of the soul. When we talked about that, there’s a persona, uh, element of our psyche, which is the mass that we were to other for others then what we don’t accept or we don’t allow, accept about ourselves or think is unacceptable traits in just being a human being. In the world we put in the shadow and the shadow of a lot of people are familiar with Young’s work. The shadow work is about reclaiming those parts that we’ve divorced from ourselves, rejected, abandoned um, and reclaim them and integrate them into our self so he could become were whole, um, But then the next level after the shadow is this wonderful energy that’s inside of us, called the anima or animus. And it depends on if you’re male or female. What when you have, and that’s what we’re going to talk about today. So when we talk about the anima animus, how would you define that? It’s a young, even had a hard time defining it, because it’s so we don’t have anything to really, um, kind of relate in a way relate to what it is because it’s beyond our conscious awareness.
Yeah, well, as a force you can think of it is these universal forces that are everywhere in nature. The day in the night, the duality, if you will, of nature Ah, the male and female, the the yin and yang. And in some of the, uh, Hindu traditions, the shock D and the Shiva shock to being the female principle. And she’s hoping the male principle and yoga was really the union of those two universal forces to to transcend them. In essence, are our workers. Human beings used to transcend our biology because if we only live it by the biology, then it’s It’s like a friend of mine used to get the press when we were learning about DNA and and the jeans and how they propel us to to reproduce right. It’s like a biological imperative. Every living thing wants to reproduce, and they leave its d n a. So if you only think of that as well, that’s that must be the sole purpose off love and relationships. Then you’re reducing it down. Teoh.
Well, that’s why people that talk about hormones and biology of love, and that’s sort of taking the magic in the and the spiritually mystical aspects of romantic love,
right? So for ah psychologically, of where psychological beings were spiritually beings, and so it has to mean something or we have to come to terms with it at that level, new at those levels and this at the psychological emotional level and in it at this spiritually level. So this force obviously plays out in in our life in an incredible way.
So it’s like the ourselves. Our surfer, superficial Selves is sitting on this amazing energy and that we don’t realize it. And then we end up falling for someone. And they have the amazing energy, and we want to get it through the other person.
Yeah, you know, it’s always good to consult the Greeks. They were so good at looking at these things for philosophically. So they had a couple of things as faras attraction, which is really where, where the story begins of love, they said, There’s there’s a couple elements of love that they called Lutece and Arrows. Lutece is that playful, flirting this right, that kind of playing around and falling in love. But we don’t want to get stuck there because then we always see those people right, that
they lost that spark very
well. They they think that that is the totality of love. They they have that flirty feeling, always going or else that it’s not love, but it’s really just the starting point. Ah, Arrows is more about the sexual attraction and the that kind of developing that flirty nous into real passion. And that real passion, of course, leads to, ah, bigger things like marriage or couple ing and and attachment and bonding. Um,
so we were talking about what is the anima animus?
So? Well, we were talking that in the context of that force, So that force propels us through these psychological mechanisms of flirty Innis and an attraction to experience something deeper.
Yes, I do want to step back, though, and just define anima animus so people can have that framework. So in young psychology, if you’re a female on a conscious level, you’re at your opposite. Would be they would be the animus. And for men, they have the anima. And if you’re not sure, or your, um, non binary and all those, you have to discover what you have in your unconscious, which which side it would be. But right now, let’s just keep it simple, and then, well, we can go into more complicated ideas. But so a woman has an image of a man It’s called the animus a masculine image in her psyche. It’s like a masculine force that she represses. And then what man has the feminine force that he represses? And if you think about it socially, that’s what we dio were a woman. We grow up. We don’t wanna be like boys, you know, we’re proper girls air, you know, don’t get dirty and all. You know all those things, like be sweet and nice and kind And boys air don’t cry, Don’t do this So a lot of our emotional of men, A lot of their emotional, um, tendencies get pushed in the in their shadow. But also it’s that denying that feminine So we have this kind of opposite. And then the force is I was born with us as we were. This isn’t something what was formed as we grow up, it’s always there, and it’s kind of a force that we tap into when we fall in love.
Yes, select duality. Let’s say young. The way he saw it was that duality off day and night. Light and shadow is built into our individual psyche, and it takes the form of whatever we’re expressing in our conscious life as male or female. The unconscious than is going to take the opposite roll. It’s it’s complimentary room because it works like a battery,
were both feminine and masculine and even Ah, a lot of well went men, especially. They were all female until their cell turned to femine Female. They were all female until they the DNA switched two male. And so they have an extra skip in there when they’re born to. So they’re all female initially
were biological. Biological? Yeah, here we’re talking about more the psychological level, like, you know, what do we express in our conscious ah, living life, you know, in our in our social life and are being so often a man will express the masculine qualities of directness, of logic, of reason, of action taking, action, taking ah, the leadership role and the women or woman might express the the yielding force the receptive community, the building of community, the nurturing element. Uh, now these air not strict. Obviously we see that, like you say there in both of us, both male and female, but one predominates. So we can say that that’s the conscious element. Then the unconscious takes the opposite roll the things. It’s not really this, uh, it’s not really repression. It’s more like like we ignore it, right? We we were not focused on it. And so it fades into the background into the unconscious.
And so when we just to be clear, this is not about your personal history, this is not about, um this anima animus is something you’re born with. It’s part of your psyche that you have already
there. Universal. Yeah. Ah, and and you can see it reflected in all of nature. All animals work on the same principle.
So, you know, one of things young talked about was that it’s, um it’s a force that’s autonomous, which means that it has kind of a life of its own. It has a, you know, kind of ah ah will of its own in a way. And so we’re born with this force. We have this. We think we’re in control of our lives. We can make choices like I want a man whose blah, blah, blah and he has a good job. And he’s, you know, wonderful. And a man wants a woman who’s sexy and, you know, obedient to him. or whatever they want. And we’re smart and all those things and not, you know, a lot of drama. And so we have this force in this desire. But the but unconsciously that anima animus depending on your Miller female forces, you, you know, first of all, connect with the opposite sex because really, truly, if we didn’t have that force, we kind of want to be around her own kind. So you’re socially conditioned to be like a woman. You kind of are marked like a lot of women say, I wish I was a lesbian because I think I get along better with women than men, you know? But But we have this desire for love that we can’t control. It’s like this. And so this is what we’re talking about with the Adam animals. This is force that’s trying to connect us, but it’s trying to connect with our ourselves. But through the forces also to find ourselves through another.
Yes, Oh ah, the you mentioned the personal history and that that’s an important piece because it does play into the way we choose our mates. Absolutely. We see it over and over that people replay the family patterns, intergenerational family patterns. Often there’s a theme of Ah, betrayal. Or they might be a theme of divorce. Or that might be a theme of Ah ah, infidelity
or Sarah Woman being the submissive one.
Yes, all those things. So you we want to be aware of those things because that becomes essentially part of our shadow. Now, those other things we repress often because we don’t want to look at them or we think I don’t want any part of that, right? Yeah, we’re going on rejected. Yeah, we reject it, but in rejecting it, it doesn’t go anywhere. It simply goes into our personal unconscious. Then it’s projected onto the other person, right when we fall in love, when we project that that anima animus force onto onto the beloved person. Ah, it’s mixed up with the shadow because we if you
have a beautiful force that one shooter find that have that divine expression of masculine feminine connection, but it gets distorted. It’s kind of like this beautiful force of light. And then there’s this filter of this shadow that kind of makes you fall in love with the people that match your pattern. Vs who you know, who you consciously really want. And so you’re split amongst yourself. And so just to, uh, reiterate, it’s kind of like again that there’s these layers of us, you know, we think we’re so once you know, so simple. But we’re very complicated, complex creatures. It’s not about just thinking positive and putting a vision board up in hoping love comes its’s. We have this conscious mind. We have the unconscious patterns of emotional template that we’ve been given through our life, and then underneath that is this spiritually force of the anima or animus that is driving us to connect. So this is why you know, I want to talk about one of the things that we see a lot is that we either see people really, truly like one. Went one, went love. You know, I gotta find it. I gotta find it. It’s It’s like an obsession. And then we see the polar opposite where people are saying that I don’t I don’t wanna really I don’t need it. I’m working on my business right now. I’m working on my career or I’ve been divorced three times. I’m focusing on my kids and there’s either an extreme like one level of Oh my God, I have to have it or I’m gonna, like, die tomorrow or I don’t need it at all. And so but we wanna say that both of those forces, it’s almost a Ziff. We still aren’t control. We aren’t connected to our anima animus, that deeper level. We haven’t understood what’s really going. You know what that forces. And Ah, for some women, it’s riding that force. But keep repeating the same pattern. And the other woman who’s rejecting it is sitting on that force. But she feels the pressure, but she has to put up the persona of Oh, I don’t need a relationship Right now. I have everything men, sucker, women suck and their terrible and you know it’s it’s weakness to want a relationship, and we’re kind of pushing away that desire, and but eventually we way. We know where we know, although the we don’t think anyone knows. But we know inside. If we’re suppressing and denying that desire, So what we what, really the anima animus is that desire to connect. It’s like part of our journey in life. We talked about this on our last podcast about the spiritual journey in love. It’s it’s part of our journey is to to work with relationships. It’s so, um so what does falling in love mean in the animal?
In the context, in the context of this, this incredible universal force that’s compelling us to move towards another than divine other. So when we fall in love, right the the one walks into the room and our hearts phone said, our heart no, our heart re kind of breaks in a sense because we see that there’s something beyond me, right? There’s some baby on my little cocoon and I want some of that.
It connects you to that something inside of you that so deep is like you could feel it. Touch it because it’s like a week I think of it is in a weakening in awakening the anima animus with me fall in love. It’s like What is that? What is this feeling? And we first feel it when we have our first crush.
Yeah, um called it the soul image Eso when the soul image arises in us, of course, were transformed is like nothing is the same. After that, we were completely transported back to the Garden of Eden. And
that’s way our first love is so precious. It’s almost like a lot of people say they can never forget their first love. That’s right, because it’s that it’s the innocents with that feeling. It’s our first taste of it.
Yes, yes, unfortunately, like we were saying
when when we haven’t done our shadow work, What happens is that the the unconscious projection includes a lot of the fear about intimacy or the things that we pushed away about our families systems, that we didn’t want to experience those things, that we pushed him away. But now, because the unconscious is open, they come up and guess who is going to be the receiver of all that shadow projection that when you love, that’s right. That’s why we end up hurting each other so badly, and we see all we all this wall. Those have seen the couples that were so in love than end up hating each other and becoming enemies because of that unknown process Shadow. Yeah, it’s this happened under shadow work.
They haven’t done their shadow work, and they they feel like the other person is having all those issues and they haven’t realized it. It’s just a projection of this unknown. I’m resolved ideas in themselves, and this isn’t like thinking about something’s broken in you and that we’re all broken. And, you know, I heard someone say we we matched by the wounds in ourselves and it really is more of a It’s that when we pull together, were actually there, too, in a way rescue each other like we’re here to awaken each other and ah and ah and realize what that person we perceive that person doesn’t accept in us is really what we don’t accept in us. If they’re putting us down or their, you know, running away because they don’t think were attractive, our ghosting us, we have to come to terms with How have we abandon ourselves? Have where do we don’t love ourselves deeply versus ah, I think you know, we make the other person they use that term container. We make the other person that container for all our you know, salvation. And that is such a huge burden to put on someone else to say you are in charge of making me feel OK about myself and when we don’t like it when it’s put on us. But that’s the power of the atom animus. It’s it’s like drives us to have this resolution of these parts that are unresolved. But then, if you’re not aware of what’s happening, you end up blaming the other person or are saying that that person is the one who’s causing all my problems. Are being too needy or, you know, putting too many demands on me when I was, you know, my whole thing just to kind of give a story is my mother. I love her. She’s wonderful. And But when I was younger, I had this teacher in sixth grade, Mrs Tabaro, See, And she would always talk about feminism and I would come home and I’d be like, Yeah, feminism And my father was like, Oh, no, he was like Archie Bunker and my mother was like, you know, the typical has stayed home, Mom and I used to think, Well, I don’t want to be that I don’t want to be trapped and not have, you know, be independent. And I just was kind of this stride young woman. And so when I grew up. If a man tried to control me, I said no, no, no, no. I ran away, and then I still wanted love. But I was afraid of being trapped. And so that’s what I kept creating. So any man that loved me and adored me, I was like, Red flag, I gotta go. You’re gonna tell me what to do? I’m gonna end up being a housewife with has no power. And it was all this power game, and it was all based on that template. And actually, as I grew up, I realized my mother had so much power. But my perception of that template is what’s important. So we think that our mothers air being submissive. But when actuality, they held all the power. But we didn’t realize it cause as kids, we see one perspective. So it’s really important to understand that your past experience isn’t what actually happened. And you talk about when we talk about that. A lot is that this shadow side is really what we perceived that family dynamic to be rather than what it actually waas.
Yeah, and it’s it’s like you say It’s not about fixing or healing. It’s simply that were. If we’re are not aware of, if we if we have it in the unconscious mind, then it’s projected out because that’s the tendency of our mind is we see that we see the world through that emotional template that is built up in our family life. And that’s that’s how we see the whole world through that. That emotional template, especially relationships
and that animus force, you know, as I’m thinking about this, like the animus Force and me was just a sphere Justus passionate of pulling me away from the guys that were really nice. It’s like this force was like, Hold like, you know, there’s the Shadow was saying No, no, no. But I felt like it was the same force of me wanting to go toward the men that are unavailable. And it was, um, I called it the flirt Penis, loot lettuce and and I just kind of was always I would say, my my friends would be like, Oh, did you have a date last night? And I’d say, Yeah, and they So did you feel fluffy, Deb? And I’m like, No, no flor fee, Haddonfield flirty or I lost the filler Penis, and I would lose that passion with people that were a threat to that freedom. So it’s almost like the force was always there. But the target was the love of horses with the force was always with me, but the ego was is always just kind of way. We create these conditions to it when we were younger, to protect ourselves or to think, you know, in a way, like we strategized the survival mechanisms and our toolkit to keep us from being trapped or from, you know, had a good intention. But if we don’t realize that that’s not really and all those assumptions aren’t looked at, we end up making those decisions unconsciously. And then we ran and we feel like this force makes us fall in love with the people that are wrong for us in a way. But they’re actually right for us because the reflecting her pattern. So whenever we feel a strong attraction to someone, even if they’re wrong, it’s what we call the trigger. It’s exactly where we need to not go toward the person, but go go inside ourselves and say, Wow, this person is kicking up a lot of energy at me. And how do why There’s something here for me, especially if on a conscious level, you know, Yeah, they’re they’re kind of not, You know that, Not the right. But I feel this, like, urged to be with them. That’s the That’s where you say OK, there’s something here and ah, let me work with this feeling and a lot of times we don’t see it with people that were not attracted to. We only see it when we’re really attracted to and heartbroken. And the best times for us to really work on ourselves and become who we only Lars after a divorce or break up.
Yeah, because it kind of brings a lot of stuff up. Yeah, when we go through the divorce of break up, we we go through it music. We go through that that dark night of the soul where were forced to look at our emotions and what is in the unconscious, what’s coming up for us and it’s great processes. So from that point of view, Young would say that it’s that the animus is is really prompting us towards individual ation from the anima animus is prompting us towards becoming our true self are complete self and really, if you see great relationships, that’s what they do for people. They allow the the individual to flourish as an individual to find their their their profession, to express their work, to really be comfortable in their own skin and express. You know, their mother and as their father is all that good stuff that’s in us. Ah, good relationship is that’s what it’s meant to do is allow us to to express the fullness of our being. And so it has a spiritual component. Even the heart breaks their their men to teach us. They’re meant to guide us inward into that deeper realm of the unconscious mind.
And there are some feminine aspects and archetypes in the unconscious, not just the animus, but the animus for a woman is a primary one. That basically is the is really the doorway to all the others. And ah, we we wanna look at it not in a masculine like male male characteristic, but more of a energy then and and, um and this force in us, If we don’t, we don’t do our shadow work. What will happen is this force needs to express itself. Ah, and so for a woman, the animus if it’s they call it a possession, it kind of takes over the ego. And at times all this energy starts to, uh, possess the ego, which the ego is already negative. We get into for women, get into hyper negative judging. It’s almost like the nagging woman or the, you know, the kind of crank we call it. The cranky old man you know on that nothing’s ever good and we’ve all had those moments. It’s like a state where the where this force actually takes over. We’ve all had those moments. Ah, and you know, some weekends were just like beating ourselves up. And it’s an animus possession. It’s just like this forces going. I have nowhere to go. So I’m just gonna magnify everything in your ego. And so the best thing to do for a woman is to find a way to ground herself and connected and not, you know, kind of find a way to work with this force. For a man, the opposite happens, since the man is that his opposite is the feminine principle that’s more emotional, so men actually become the nine year old mean girl and kind of a bratty, you know, they get they kind of become their emotions, start taking over their psyche. So that’s where there’s like That’s why I think a lot of men do more crimes because they’re passionate and angry and, you know, they use the force in an emotional way. They kind of they can. They can actually lose it. So if you’ve ever been in a fight with a man and you’re trying a woman’s trying to talk it out cause women the mat animus is the logic. So it wants to talk it out and we talk about it with our friends, and we’re like, Oh, and Jimmy, you know what he did and we’re rationalizing and your friends are all going, Yeah, you know, that’s it. And we analyze and a man he doesn’t put it into words. He moves through emotion when he’s upset when he’s, um, possessed, and so he’ll go for a run. He’ll slam the door. Believe Well, you know, use whatever force he needs. He might want to do some sports. Teoh remove that energy and women. We like to sit around and we like to analyze. So it’s so funny because we think we’re feminine and were women. But the animus is that part of our mind that takes over and that rationalization and justification. And we like to use words where men use the feeling and emotion that Ah
yeah, and their power for drinking. I mean, I come from a drinking culture that those two Yeah, I was Well, that not not really. I mean, initial. You might think it’s kind of a self
minutes, a release of emotion because the inhibited the the ego doesn’t inhibit the motion and so they can be passionate and let it go.
Right? But what would come out was this this little girl like you say, the people would become very, ah, kind of sentimental over.
So yeah, they talk with their buddies and the Lego Jimmy, that was a great time. They start crying, and then they’re like, We can’t talk about this tomorrow.
Yeah, yeah, and it’s kind of a nen maturity. You say it’s a nine year old, right? This very for ah, that kind of get into bar fights. But remember these air. Let’s say extreme examples of people that are unconscious. Yeah, and we’ve all been there is young people, you know, that we didn’t know what to do with the emotions and and the attraction that we felt for other people. Ah, and that plays out. But as you go through this individual ation process, essentially what you’re learning all the range of emotions in the psyche and and how to play them like an instrument.
Yes, it’s like orchestra,
very much so. So so that it becomes your best friend. The emotions become your best friend and they complete you. They give you a way to experience life in a much more conscious way in a much more Ah, let’s see much your way. And ah, And so when you do, you shadow work. You’re not pushing away your past history, but your understanding how it contributed to who you are. Mm. What gifts it gave you. And it Ah, it becomes in a vehicle for this next stage the anima animus where instead of looking at life from your particular point of view, because love gives you the opportunity to transcend yourself to transcend the duality
egos terrified of real love, because it loses because you lose yourself with someone that is a battle inside, saying Hold back, give up too much, right? Because go for the wrong person because there’s no chance for them to threaten you. You’re not going to be a threat if they’re always running away,
right? But if you want to experience love, you have to surrender your ego. Yeah, there’s no other way. If you hold on to your ego, you’re holding onto your defenses. Yes, that you built up from your past experiences, and therefore, no matter how perfect the relationship may appear from the outside, it will not have that deep connection because you’re you’re still shut down, you’re still defending. And so the surrender of the ego is where a lot of people get caught up right? It’s It’s very difficult. It does require kind of some kind of training where at least some kind of structure that you know, ah, Joseph Campbell said. That that was the function of mythology and ritual was to give us the opportunity to do that. Difficult work come letting go of ourselves a Zygo. The old persona has to die in his new being has to come into in tow life through the relationship.
Yeah, a lot of Ah, you know, I’ve heard so many stories of men who have said I really you know, the woman scared him because he really had that strong feeling for her. So a lot of times when we get rejected and relationships, it’s not that you were so terrible, But maybe you were so good that they were like, uh and so, uh, a person can only accept someone else in their life as much as they accept their self. So the work is about going out there and finding your animus. It’s going inside, working with the parts of yourself that you haven’t accepted. So when that force, it will connect you to someone who accepts all of you if you accept all of you, so it’s the external conflict is always reflecting the internal conflict. And, you know, I remember when I was single I used to always go for the guy that I couldn’t have. And, um, I realized how it was like I had this moment of clarity of my pattern. I was like, Oh, my God, I’m chasing all these men. They don’t want commitment.
It’s a good Langen is.
Yeah, I’m the one who doesn’t want a commitment. Oh, my God, I am I was so afraid of letting anyone get close to me and, ah, and then when I realized that I was like, Oh, so it’s not out of my hands So it’s It’s was always in my control, and it was like I saw, like, my whole life flash before me, and I thought of all those wasted years of my life that I didn’t do the shadow er to say, I pushed so many great guys away because I was so scared of my own inner self and and, ah, and it’s that full self acceptance. And it’s not that Oh, I’m a great person and I love myself and I, you know, people like me kind of affirmation. It’s this deep, um, reverence for who you are, like this soul of who you are and that you it’s okay for you to make mistakes. It’s okay for you to be, you know, stupid sometimes or clumsy. Robbie accepts my clumsiness and ah, and that we is like that self acceptance on a deep level, not the persona acceptance, but that self acceptance that bill puts an opening for that other person to come in. Almost all relationships a lot of women don’t realize or men don’t realize, is that they’re pushing themselves away when they get rejected. It’s a part of themselves that they’ve been pushing away, not that other person. So when someone leaves, they’re rejecting something in themselves. When you leave your rejecting something in yourself and and and Young is all about acceptance and you know there’s a when the element to that I want to say is that ego, the ego that we have is just one part of our psyche. Its function is to keep us alive and safe. It has a specific function. We don’t want to get rid of it. And it’s kind of caught up in patterns of thinking and negativity. And it’s always like trying to, like, warn us of the past and
but we can exist transcending the ego. And so I think a lot of people think transformation means let me fix this little voice in my head, and then then that will have a transformation. But I want to tell you the voice never goes away. Even if you transcend, and you’re more or self aware that little voice is always going to be there. So I think a lot of people get stuck, is trying to fix their ego when there’s this whole vast like we talk about the of our psyche and other parts of ourselves that are so much bigger than the ego that we could use on. We’re focused on this little tiny little voice and trying to get it to behave when it’s never going to behave. You can’t transform the ego. It’s it’s gonna be there, but we can transcend it. So there’s a difference between transforming the ego and transcending the ego.
Well, Sq, this one
asked me a question. I’m ready.
What about people that this side, they want to be alone? The marriage partnership is not for them.
I would ask them to say, Are they making that decision based on fear? And initially they’ll say no. But I would love for them to sit with that If love was a choice. If you had a choice, if you could wave a magic wand and there be a wonderful, loving ideal person, would you say no to that? I think a lot of people say I want to be alone because they don’t feel like they have the power to to be with someone, you know, that they have kind of given up in a way that it’s it’s all about the choice and choice gives you power. So if you could choose, I’ll be alone. That somehow feeds the egos power like I’ve chosen this versus I want like looking weak like I want love, but no one wants me. And so it’s about really being honest with yourself and sitting with Is this really my choice? And you might have to sit with it for a while and and go into your heart and ask, Is this really my choice? Yeah, So I I always say to my clients, I say, I don’t want ready. So if the ideal guy knocked on the door, you would have to do anything you know, personal development, nothing. Just open the door and he’s there and he’s loves you and he’s perfect. And he looks like a Brad Pitt or, you know, someone younger. What’s the new one that everyone likes? The guy from Thor, You know, Hemsworth there and He’s gorgeous and he’s, you know, rich and loving and kind and everything you’ve ever wanted and or whatever it may be, good looking isn’t important to you and and And Would you push it away if he if the you knew that you wouldn’t get heartbroken? And I guarantee you, most people would say, Yeah, I think I would like that. I mean, if they’re really being honest with themselves, is toe have that experience? It is someone saying yes, transcending that, just being trying to just be alone and having that divine relationship and actually expanding your consciousness with someone else and having more of life with someone else versus just, you know, having that personal experience. You’re having a joint experience.
And what would happen to the Let’s say, the person that is alone? Would there be a way to work with their animus or a woman? That’s loan? Would there be a way to work with her animus?
Well, she would have to work with her shadow. First, she would have to do to her shadow work and then understand her, her patterns and the and not just understand. Oh, I know what happened to me more like what is the defenses that I built up around love that because of the story that I told myself when I was younger? What is the emotional template and that emotional template? Are all those emotional defenses from letting someone in? And so be once you’re aware of that, then you connect with the inner Adam, where we call the inner Adam or the animus, uh, in dreams. He’ll show up in people you know, other people. You’ll see a reflection of that when we fall in love and we have that killer fi feeling with someone. We’re seeing an aspect of that animus, but it’s covered up with her shadow. And so the first step of all of us. Just look at your life. Look at the last person you fell in love with. There’s a divine element where you feel that really beautiful feeling and then the you know, the heartbreak and all that other stuff covered over it that you’re seeing your animus and your shadow right there. It’s all there. It’s right there for you. It’s not hidden, but if you don’t, if you’re projecting and saying, Oh, that person is was wrong Me and maybe I’m not good enough and he rejected me. Then you’re kind of missing the whole gift of that situation that’s showing you in reflecting. What’s inside? Yeah, so we teach our coaches. This isn’t what we train in a coaching program is how toe haven’t help people see that reflection like an X ray machine and say, Oh, I see this clearly. Now my percent. What I’m perceiving is showing me something about my mind, and it’s right there. And a coach who knows step coaching could really help a client instead of like, Oh, yeah, he’s a jerk. Keep your boundaries. Shut off your phone, go out and date again and find someone else that coach can say, Let’s look at this relationship right now. Let’s look at your heart ache. Let’s look and not from a fixing place but a self awareness and help the person see, like, kind of late, lift the veil of of ah, misperception and see what’s really there. And then, like I said, I saw this whole pattern and it was like instantly turned something in me because then I realized I was the one creating it, and until you take responsibility for your love life. It’s not gonna change. You have to take 100% responsibility that this is coming from my mind. And that’s really where the change happens. And so then you’re just projecting your saying. But no, Debbie, you don’t understand. My ex boyfriend was a narcissist or my ex husband, you know, cheated. And you know this guy, you know, didn’t have any money, or this guy was too needy. Great. Let’s see. What is that reflecting about your mind? What do you pushing away? What is this showing you? Because nothing is independent of your mind that thes opportunities show up. The people that you’re passionately drawn to are probably the the most powerful way for you to transcend your ego and actually have that self realization that we all want that enlightenment that we all want is actually in the seat of heartache. Can really show us that Well said. Yeah. Okay. Well, let’s go to questions. We got some wonderful questions here. Uh, let’s see that. It’s, um, was asking about about this recording. Yes. Well, if you’re coming in late and you’re going Oh, I missed the beginning. It’ll be posted here in the group so you can watch it in our unit section. You’ll see it. And then also, this is going to be on our podcast as well. So you can check out our podcast creative mind living and will be simulcasting it there. Okay, do those anima animus. Shadow projections map in the ego level of anxious avoidant attachment styles and for avoidant or ambivalent females. Does that mean overreliance on masculine force? Even if your natural state is feminine? Well, our natural state is both feminine and masculine. Ah, but yes, when we talk about attachment style such a shadow, that’s the shadow work. It’s what what are re pushing away in the shadow, the actually, the attachment styles or the expression of the shadow of our ego. And then the shadow is what is what is You know, what are we afraid of that we created that there’s attachment social, like a defense defending the ego. So, yeah, I don’t know if it’s ah feminine, masculine, that type of thing. But it’s really what we decided about who we are for a woman, uh, around that idea.
Well, if we drop the masculine feminine no, all we’re doing is relating to the other. Yes, right. There’s an other person in in our consciousness and our awareness now and how we relate to that other person. That’s what the anima animus is talking about.
Very question. Yeah, we have another way to look at the attachment styles. It’s Ah, the two questions is, How were the everywhere do you feel of love? And then how while do you trust others? And we teach that one of our other programs? But yeah, we kind of you decide which one you are, and there’s four quadrants, and they’re based on the Colby’s attachment styles. How do we incorporate spirituality in surrendering the ego? It’s like approaching finding love from non attachment perspective. Well, here’s the thing. It’s this idea of finding love needs to be, um, re, ah, kind of framed in your mind because love is really already here, like the animus that soul level love is already inside. That’s why we feel it when we see people were just projecting it out there so understanding that it’s already here and we always hear Oh, the love is already inside of you, but you have to have a direct experience. And so it’s, I guess it’s like surrounding the ego, but it’s understanding the ego. It’s not pushing it away, but understanding that the ego is going to still play its game, it still has a job to do to protect you. And it is only seizure is this little human being, and it’s being able to see yourself beyond the ego, and that’s really it. Non attachment is the key because you’re really when you’re attached, you’re actually in fear that you’re not. You can’t have what you want. And so the other layer is well, if it’s inside of me already, have it eso if you don’t need anybody well, it’s not that I don’t need anyone, but now I want to find someone on a conscious level that I choose to connect with this within it. You’re not coming from a deficit where I I lack something and I want to
come forward. Choice.
It’s a choice, and that’s really more power. And then that leads to non attachment. Great question. I’m noticing kind of duality of myself. On one side, I have the same fear of relationship that double describe that I would be trapped and die. I could never decide that the that the would be the right moment for fully committed relationship do not want to be like my mom on the other side. I have a feeling that some previous life I know this has not happened in this life. I had love of a soul level, which I lost something like a death of a beloved one and have never been able to find anyone like this. I feel like I have a hole in my heart that never heals and searching for it, but lost forever, very hard. Is there any way how to find out what happened? Well, what happened was that it’s the animus that your that you think is experienced in another life is. Actually, it’s already here. It’s right here. That’s the animus. It’s always with you. It’s pre born with you. Uh, that’s really what that soul level love is. And so, um like, I don’t know past lives and all those things. It’s just those air, basically just different egos that you’ve re related to the soul level. Love is something that you’ve had for eternity, so it’s already here, so it’s not like I got to find out what happened. We know what happened. You had. You have a soul level, um, passion of love inside of you that you carry always and ah, and it’s about finding it inside yourself, not in another lifetime or through another person. Does that make sense? Do you have a
kind of, Well, I’m Yeah, I mean, it’s a difficult question because it’s like it can’t be answered logically, Yeah, but it is a calling that longing that you have that feeling of. There’s something missing. It’s a calling right life. Or let’s say the the individual ation process, which wells up from within, is always prompting us to do the work. It’s always telling us do with this, you know, find love, create love, experience, love because that that is our true nature. That’s what were designed for, like a bird is designed for flight. We are designed for this expression of the divine through our temporary life.
And you know, it’s interesting if you if there is past lives and we believe in past lives, that love is what we carry through the lives, and it’s not in that person. That other person that were experiencing. But it’s this anima animus, this energy that we carry, so it’s not that it can be found. You know, three lifetimes ago, I had that experience. It’s it’s in us already. We carry throughout our existence, says it’s trans personal
Basia. The only reality is actually that now, because if you think well, I’m thinking about the past. But you’re thinking about the past right now. When you think about the future, you think about the future. Right now, This moment and so all that exists is always this. Now, this eternal. Now that’s always here. This is where we do our work. Not not in the future, not in the past. It’s right here in this moment,
and when you have that so level love, it feels as though you’ve known each other forever. It feels as though you’ve had many, many lifetimes together because you’re really connecting to the eternal part of yourself. That’s beyond the persona, ego, personal history, shadow. It’s this deeper self and that’s really I mean, imagine that’s what we really want is we want to transcend our ourselves and become immortal, and we want to have that experience in our life, our own immortality. That’s what this really true deep love can can give us. Is that taste of that drinking from the nectar of immortality? As they say. So yeah, beautiful. But it’s you use that kind of beloved feeling that, um to put compel you to transcend the fear of being trapped in a relationship are being trapped in the wrong one. Because every relationship is the right relationship. It’s always there for you to You’re looking, your animus comes with you and it’s just showing you that What’s in the way of you seeing the divine in yourself?
Yeah, it’s funny, right? That love should be, ah, associated with death or the feeling of the dread of death. But if you think about it makes sense because it’s the death of the ego, just the death of the old self. But letting go of all that childhood, uh, attachment that we had
someone with PTSD has fallen in love with me. Does that mean I need to do more shadow work? Well, it it really is. What? Your response to that IHS, what is your response? Not the PST and him. But what is your response to that. What are you making that mean about you? What is? Does it cross fear? Um what? You know what is specifically the pattern? And a lot of times, the shadow is not a direct like I have PTSD in my shadow, but there’s something similar, Like a fear
or the opposite. Or it might be a need for for nurturing or taking care of.
Yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah. So someone yeah, that’s true. The mother type would would want to take care of someone, uh, who’s injured? Eso It could be a tendency of the persona. Um, so, yeah, definitely. Look at what’s what is what is there? Um and ah, there’s always shot of work to do. So you need to do more shadow work. Welcome to the world that they were always creating shadow and And when we realize that, then we’re not thinking it’s hard work. We’re just seeing it’s part of having our psyche is alive. It’s not what they told you that it’s this kind of ah program. If you rewire the program, then all of a sudden you’re this perfect human being. It’s such a lie, our psyches alive. It’s constantly creating And the only thing that’s true and lasting is the awareness that we’re alive. So that awareness that were you’re aware right now that’s the only true reality. The other stuff is in constant flux all the time, and so is we’re riding this wave of life. It’s it’s the shadow. Work is part of us remembering who we really are. So don’t think of it is. You know, I think personal development has had a bad rap. It’s like this hard work. I gotta work on myself, but it’s really it should be. It should be an adventure that we’re doing. We’re discovering new lands, new treasures in our in our psyche. We’re getting to know each other and ourselves in always. It’s a beautiful process. So, yes, send him my way. Okay, the guy at the door. But here’s one for you, Rob. Does anima animus play out in the child tension with a parent? Not just the romantic partner, right?
Because, um, let’s let’s say the the animus anima. They’re templates there were born with them already until the opposite sex parent gives us a lot of information, and we associate the let’s say for a woman the father becomes like their first experience off the animals
for the end of brothers.
And so the way you relate to that experience, the relationship with your father becomes imprinted and becomes a symbol of the animus, in part because it’s a universal meaning. It’s already got its agenda, but the way it plays out is often associated with the father. The relationship with the father.
So the things about your father that you rejected go into your shadow and they’re played out in your animus. Attraction, uh, were accepted. And you look for a man who’s like If you adored your father, you know, you may look for a man just like him, but then the things of the opposite you may end up seeing in them, too, because there’s no one is no person has all perfect qualities and traits. We all have a mixture of late and or qualities, and it’s how accepting we are of that is Ah, and it’s hard to accept. Our parents don’t accept us. They want us to be good, and they want us to follow rules. And so we have all that judgment in us, right?
Yeah, and and so the only the only problem is it. If you don’t do shadow work, you end up playing out those patterns. Now you you may say, Well, I had a great relationship with the father. Well, that’s great, but it’s still unconscious now. Your your plane, you’re simply playing out of pattern, and what you want to do is you want to have a choice in in what kind of love experience you create for yourself. And the only way to do that is to do your shadow work before you get into our relationship. Like Young said, the best time to do Ah ah, really. Ship work is before you. You are in one.
So ah, for a daughter, would that also play out in the mother wound of the ego?
Yes, we see that, um, with the daughter has a relationship with the mother. Very powerful one man. It has to do with what do you identify with in your mother and what do you reject about her? And we we’d see. I mean, this is simple example, but we see that often the stay at home mother Ah, the daughter may reject that because she wants to be an independent woman and go and have a career. So she rejects the state home mother and all that it entails. And so often she’s throwing out that, Ah, relationship, right? Because stay at home Mom is the one that it’s waiting for the father and, you know, to
and submissive to the man and and or even just open to letting the man
be in her life. That’s right. And so you have to look at those things not in the in the sense of judging or good and bad. It’s simply what did you experience is a kid because that’s gonna play big time into the way you you do relationships. And as an adult.
Um, OK, here’s a couple more questions. I heard that the third love in our life is a slow warming. The first love is love at first sight. The second is about doing difficulty. What? What can you give insight on that? Well, I think that you’re describing basically the ego working its way through love, and it doesn’t necessarily have to be that way. I mean, the first love is the egos caught off guard. It’s like never had that experience before So we full really hard the first time. And then the difficult one, I would say, is the shadow. You know, you’re really working with the shadow, and then if you individuated, then you can have that great love. Maybe that’s your third love, but it’s it’s It depends on each person, like we hate to put people in categories of like you’re going to go through a process like Elizabeth Kubler Ross. When she came up with the stages of grieving. She regretted it in the end because it was in the wrong order. So we never went a kind of put an expectation that this, if you’ve only had two loves or the second love is going to be hard, it doesn’t necessarily have to be true. The earlier you start individual ation process, like in younger than when you know when you’re 60 year started, it’s it, kind of. Maybe it’ll play out that way, But if it’s starting it in 2030 years old, you know you start to individuated your your love life will play out differently. So it just depends on you and where you’re at, um, for a daughter, OK, that if we had an absent father. How does that impact the animus?
Course, yeah. Yeah. Well, remember you it’s it’s instilled in you already, so it doesn’t mean you don’t have an animus. What happens is then your ego, your mind, essentially will will find father figures to identify with. And they
also not Maybe not. Trust them.
There might be that it depends on how it plays out, right? What the mother says about the absence of the father, right? If she’s always, ah, kind of giving the child a bad impression that, you know, he was no good because of this, Not then the child might like. I said, Grow up with, like, you said, that that distrust student up man or abandonment of the feeling of abandonment.
I’ll I see a lot of women with the absent father. They date older men. They’ll be a lot older man, 2020 years older to be like I always state men that air, you know, 20 years older than me. Hey, they’re looking for that father figure.
Yeah, that’s exact. That’s a good example right there. That that if you’re not conscious of things and they happen in your past, yeah, you’ll end up playing them out unconsciously, and you’ll find good reasons or why you’re doing it s, oh, that. That’s the tricky part that on the surface, they make sense because you you rationalize them and you come up with his little narrative as to why you’re choosing those things. But they’re really coming from deeper in the unconscious mind.
How do you connect to the animus?
So if you can imagine, ah, the shadow work being like the entry point into you’re deeper, unconscious mind, right? It opens up the door into that deeper process that we call a psyche. As you do your shadow work and you integrate the shadow, meaning you accept a lot of things that you pushed away, and then you had looked at in your childhood and your past. Your your integrated that meaning they become part of your awareness, your not rejecting them anymore. They’re not, for they’re not scaring you. You’re not running away from them anymore. They become part of who you are, and they give you more energy. So now you’re entering the realm of the collective unconscious, and there’s where the the animus is.
You have to do shadow work in order to really see the animus But you can get a taste of it just by think of the times you fell for someone you started, you feel that like Like I love for someone in, You know, there’s first glimpses of even if it’s Lutece that, uh,
yeah, but their But in that case, it’s possessing you.
Yeah. Oh, yeah, it’s You could still have an experience of it. How
do you Oh, yeah, you’re experiencing it. Okay, But it’s got you.
Got you. Yes. So the shadow work helps you direct. Yeah, you will see, just like
a relationship. It helps you relate to that part of your psyche in a healthy way, just like a good relationship. You’re interacting with it, and it’s helping you grow instead of causing you this restlessness and there’s, you know,
out of control. I can’t sleep. We’ll also to just on a broader stage with relationship with other elements of our psyche. It’s the same thing with the with their ego. We have to have a relationship with her ego. It’s not. Push it away. Get rid of the ego. It’s not try to change the ego. It’s like, Let’s have a relationship because then that if every everyone gets along Ah, and someone’s in charge, you can start to move in whatever you’ll get along. Yeah, but whatever you resist will persist. So it’s like the fighting and the the you know, in any relationship, if you’re arguing all the time, you’re not really getting anywhere. But if you find that kind of, how do we work together? And that’s kind of what we’re doing with these elements of ourselves. It’s like we’re like, probably says when I’m stressed about something, it’s like you’re fighting with yourself. What I’m like, I am fighting with myself. We’re having these battles within ourselves, but they’re played out in the characters in our life. We can them the scripts. And so that’s really what we’re trying to do is we’re trying to get make friends with this animus, but we really can’t get to it until you start doing shadow work. Because you well happen is you’ll just project like what we used to have People do like look at your inner Adam and do a visual station. But then they would project their egos, shadow onto this person and It’s like finding the man, and it kind of gets distorted versus the true connection with the animus.
Yeah, and ultimately it’s It is your connection with the unconscious mind and and the unconscious in the young incense. It’s much broader than just the let’s say, the things that happened to us. It’s the repository of creativity, of religious symbolism of ah, your passion for life. You know, uh, that passion that you have for another in let’s when you’re infatuated with someone, you turn it into compassion into ah, more spiritually life.
Okay, here’s one. She posted it three times, So I guess she wants to stay answers. Maybe she hit the button three couple times. How do we figure out who from our perent paternal figures in our life, who plays out the most inner inner Adam relationship wise? I met my maternal grandfather first. Then at age one or two, I met my father and then that had a stepfather. So they all play a role.
Okay? It depends on your relationship with them with those individuals. What did you you know, kind of experience with each one and often what we liked about the our grandparent’s or our uncles and all that. Those elements we absorb, right? We identify with them consciously. We say I I want to be, like, letting him or I You know, I don’t identify with that. I love that. And the things that we reject that we say, Oh, you know, that hurt my feelings or or they ignored me. And we do this instinctually remembers Children. We were very good at reading the emotional environment. Whatever the we didn’t like. We push into the shadow, but it didn’t go anywhere. And so that that will be part of your shadow work to figure out what did I identify with as the father figure? You know what I to reject about that?
I’ve been in love with three men, but then, only after I started awakening did a really have rials shadow relationship. And then the 5th 1 was more real but still projecting onto him. So the next technically should be my third after awakening and feel that I will definitely recognize my projections. Well, it’s one thing to recognize your projections. Remember, you have to work with the emotional elements there. You have to figure out more. Go, go deeper to what is it? Just not have an intellectual understanding. You have to wonder. What is the defense is that those projections have created. So you’re working with that emotion, the fears and the assumptions that you’re making about being in a relationship.
Yeah, this is a common stake. A lot of people think Well, I know my patterns and I’ve done therapy. And I know my all my ah, history and defenses and complexes. Insight is not enough. It won’t get you there because it’s again. It’s an intellectual exercise that you’re doing there. You need to go directly to the emotional experience, which means facing your fears right and in simple terms and whatever the fear is of intimacy of love. Uh, I’m not good enough. Whatever it is, you’re gonna have to face it. Then you can move forward
and all the love that you felt in those men were your love. And it’s so those falling in love. It’s like a taste of yourself. And ah, a lot of times we fall in love with people that break her heart because we’re we break our own hearts, you know, where we break our hearts every day we beat ourselves up. We don’t accept parts of ourselves. That’s what we’re. But we’re working on this, finding that wholeness. So, yes, a weakening is really important. We went a weakened, but we also wanna we have toe, you know, face the dark parts of our shadow the parts and hide all the gold that we have inside.
Yeah, I was a, uh, shadow. Work is probably the hardest thing to do, and the hardest thing we’ll do is human beings. But it’s the only worthwhile thing because nothing compares. You know, not all, not the degrees. Not the accomplishments, not the relationships. Whatever we create externally does not compare with what the shadow work gives you. That sense of yourself that grounded nous, you know, that’s invaluable.
Sorry. Didn’t mean to post my question three times. I was just trying to edit it. That’s cute. OK, that’s fine. We’re just easing. Um, that had sometimes happens. People will post and hit hit the button twice, and then it keeps
posting. But there’s no such things. Is accident
eso? Maybe he really didn’t want to know the answer. That’s no problem. I rejected most of my stepfather’s persona and has been my shadow work for sure. Yeah. Um uh, actually, I feel like my mother has a bigger impact on my romantic relationships than the male figures. Can this be possible? Yeah. When we talk about animus, remember, it’s a partnership with our conscious minds. So our conscious feminine Ah, we work with our our new system. We have the four personas that women take on, and they’re based on the four feminine archetypes the mother, the lover, the professional and the mystic. And whatever we chew, whatever, mother our mother role that we reject, we usually, um, choose the opposite. You know, we we reject the mothers, you know, stayed home, Mom, we become the professional or we reject the mother never being there for us. So we need to be the mother and and And we So we choose that role. And so those play into think about it. Your parents are the dynamic are reflecting how you in early conceive yourself. So the conscious self, the feminine and the masculine are are kind of like, if you look at your parents relationship, that’s kind of the relationship with the inner Adam. So yeah, it’s a dynamic between your parents, Not only there. A lot of people think, Oh, this is part of their personality. But what is the dynamic between the parents that’s going to reflect your inner dynamic of where the masculine and feminine? So yes, it’s very wise. I mean, I used to think that, too. It’s my dad’s issues, but really it was me rejecting the mother, the mother that caused the whole process of me being single toes in my forties and running away from all the nice guys just because I didn’t want to be trapped even though consciously, I thought I wanted to be a wife and I wanted Children, and I went in that role. And but you don’t even realize what you’re rejecting. It’s interesting. We think we know where patterns. But until you do the shot of working, really, don’t you really think you you think you got it all figured out and ah, then you’re like, Oh, it was like I remember the moment I said, Oh my God, I am doing this to myself. And then I was sad for a moment, and then I thought, Well, now I have the key, Like it was like, almost like that really shifted in my mind that now I can choose this, And until you’re aware of what that pattern is on a deep level, you’re not gonna be able to choose. And that’s what the shadow work is all about. And we recommend it to everyone, and you have to do it with the coach. This isn’t something you can do on your own and figure out and write down. You know what’s the opposite? You need someone to guide you because the ego will put. We’ll try toe, go around it, it will justify. It will say you didn’t of shadow work. It’s OK, but having a coach really helps you stay accountable and you’re invested because you’re investing in the coach and then you’re she’s you’re going to do the work. You’re going to say I’m going to get through this and it is really powerful. Uh, okay, I think those are all the questions request. So again we go deep into this work. If you’re interested, even if you don’t want to be a coach, talk to me about the life coach training that starts in June. We’re going to go through the shadow work. We’re gonna go through the inner Adam. We’re going to talk about dreams. It’s going to be, um, an amazing transformation. And you’re really gonna know yourself in deeper ways than you ever thought possible with all the coaching and all the, um, all the teachings. And, um, it’s just it’s just amazing journey, I hope, uh, if this calls to you, I hope you join us because it’s going to change your life. You never look at yourself the same way again, that’s for sure. That’s right. And and you’ll be well supported. And we have a great group already. So I’m really excited. We, um getting full pretty fast. So if you’re interested, please, Please, please apply. Speak to me directly and ask about it. And if you just want shadow work, our mentors air here in the group, they’re really ready to take you on. We have some really great pricing for the mentor coaching. Get some really great direct work from people who have trained in the process. There’s nothing out there like this. So our coaches air special. We love them. Hello mentors, and they’re really the best. You’re in good hands
Thanks for the great questions. Thanks for hanging out with us. Stay safe. Stay well, Stay hydrated and we’ll see you on our next soul session
next Saturday. So it’s our Little Souls Church on Saturdays. And we are so glad you’re here and love all the questions and the engagement and welcome to the group for the new members. And we’ll see you next week. Take care, Take care.